Where do you think nursing is headed in bad economic times?

[cougarnurse]

Welcome, northernbell!

I hear ya. I know I post both the 'good news' about jobs, etc., but also the relevent 'bad side', too. It's a vicious circle.

[angryamerican999]

You think it's getting bad now, wait until the 50,000 new Indian, Chinese, and Philippine nurses get here... then try to find a job.

Congress is working on bringing them over. See:
Search Results - THOMAS (Library of Congress)

If you want to know why you're being sold out, read my satirical rant.
http://www.ultimatenurse.com/forum/f...ead-act-35992/

[Last Nurse Standing]

Personally, I think the only solution is a kind of unionization of nurses. We have to push for staffing ratios (4 on days med/surg 5 on nights, 2 max in ICU).

The problem is there's a lot of nursing schools out there pumping out nurses. That makes competition for any union. I think the amount of nurses is going to have to shrink. If few were becoming nurses, we could demand anything we wanted. So, I welcome hospitals not hiring nurses. In the end, it will dry up the nursing schools, and the supply of nurses.

Right now, every laid off carpenter and auto worker is running to nursing school because it's thought to be so "recession proof." Every nurse who quit to raise a family but kept her license is re-entering the workforce.

I don't mean to be Nurse Doom here, but I try to keep up on economics, and when the lead story is "Homebuilders Confidence is up slightly!" and that causes a spike in the stock market, we're in for a long haul. I read the story: there's no change in the dynamics of the housing market, but homebuilders (out of work carpenters) think there might be in the future. That's it.

Let me ask you this: anyone rushing out to buy a car? Yeah, that's what I thought; me neither. In fact, I have made the decision to keep our 2005 F250 Diesel for 20 years, minimum. I'll simply have done whatever maintenance needs to be done. It's paid off in June. Guess what I'm going to do with the extra 600 dollars a month (plus the extra 1200 we've been putting toward getting it paid off early)? Do you think I'm going to stimulate the economy? Nope, it all goes to the credit card with the lowest balance, and thus it goes until my debts are clear.

That's a really good personal decision, but it damns the economy when multiplied by the rest of us.

I looked back to previous recessions: in the 80's credit began to become popular and widespread, and everybody bought things on credit, especially personal computers. This continued, but ultimately didn't keep things up in the 90's, but that's ok. In the 90's there were smaller and better computers, and the internet soared. So that worked to pull us out of a recession. Now, there is nothing. There is no industry. "Green" can't be an industry, because it doesn't generate a profit so long as oil and coal are pleantiful and cheap, and they are.

I've racked my brain, and all I can think of is legalizing marijuana might help the economy. No one needs a better computer. No one could use a smaller phone, even if they combine electric toothbrushes into them.

Where I work, everyone is planning to get out of debt while they can--if they can. Saving money and paying off debt starves the economy. And while the economy starves, houses, cars, refrigerators, ect. don't get bought, and people in those industries get laid off, and they all go to nursing school (it seems).

Bedside nursing is recession proof in that it doesn't stop being utilized in bad economic times. What hurts is when the market gets flooded with nurses. Before this is over, BSN will be the entry level degree for nursing by all state boards of nursing. Maybe that's a good thing. I don't have one. But when all debts are paid off and I finish a writing project I have in mind, I'll go into an RN-MSN program.

[Grandma-RN]

Hospital in this area is not hiring quickly either. A freeze or whatever they are calling it is not good at all.

[OldSquidNewNurse]

One of my instructors seems to think that going back to 8 hour shifts would help push the issue of increasing staffing while also increasing quality of care. Also with many people turning to nursing perhaps the job to have is in Nursing Ed?

[cougarnurse]

One of my instructors seems to think that going back to 8 hour shifts would help push the issue of increasing staffing while also increasing quality of care. Also with many people turning to nursing perhaps the job to have is in Nursing Ed?

:nurse-quotes:

Mind you, Squid, you do have a point with the 8 hour shift bit. I work 12's at times, and it stinks.

However, the bottom line is $$$. From what I have seen and heard, many co-workers have two jobs because of the pay. Also, we are understaffed. One girl quit to get a job closer to home, and is picking up PRN hours. Helps to a point.

LastNurse, you have some good points, too.

I can think of one town north of me that is tearing down smaller homes and building HUGE houses. Think of the heating requirements, for one thing. Do you think you'll be immune to needing assisted care later on?

The nurses who 'quit' nursing and are coming back are a God-send. However, they, too, are getting older, and will add to the 'greying' of the profession.

Mind you, unions may not be the answer, either. Been in one, and it did nothing for me. But, that is in the past, and i don't want to start a war over it.

That's enough of a rant on my end right now. I can't think anymore until I get some coffee.

[ppanchorage]

I have a question. When hospitals post their profits, how much of their expenses is clearly stated as bonus or management expenses? I do realize hospitals are a business and that nurses salaries are the biggest expense. Well - duh!!! I suspect part of this so called freeze and cut backs due to financial reasons is an excuse to cut back on nursing salaries. Cut back the staff and force the remaining nurses to pick up the slack.
This leaves the patient with unsafe nurses, bad care, bad outcomes, increased infection, etc, etc. Patients are not safe and new nurses just don't know what they don't know. They are victims as well.
Until the public is aware of this, it will continue.
Pass it on.

[Jo Dirt]

I've noticed people are holding onto their jobs. The facility where I work is full of nurses begging to work. Aha, this puts the facility at an advantage, they are holding the reins and calling the shots. I've heard that travel nursing at hospitals is drying up because of nurses there holding their positions. Also, the hospitals here contract out with the nursing schools to get their new grads, they basically do not hire outside the hospitals anymore.

The hospitals cried nursing shortage and schools obliged by churning out nurses by the boatload. Now, the hospitals have their pick. Instead of focusing on increasing enrollment the schools should have raised their standards and decreased enrollment. This wouldn't have helped the hospitals, though.

[Last Nurse Standing]

I've noticed people are holding onto their jobs. The facility where I work is full of nurses begging to work. Aha, this puts the facility at an advantage, they are holding the reins and calling the shots. I've heard that travel nursing at hospitals is drying up because of nurses there holding their positions. Also, the hospitals here contract out with the nursing schools to get their new grads, they basically do not hire outside the hospitals anymore.

The hospitals cried nursing shortage and schools obliged by churning out nurses by the boatload. Now, the hospitals have their pick. Instead of focusing on increasing enrollment the schools should have raised their standards and decreased enrollment. This wouldn't have helped the hospitals, though.

I think you're spot on here. I predict the future will see the end of the ADN programs for registered nurses. This economy is not going to suddenly become a boom again for a very long time. My guess is that in order to protect nursing, BONs will start requiring nurses to have a BSN. They may grandfather in ADNs or require that they get a BSN, but it's the only way to protect nursing.

I have a B.Sc. in another field and would love to get a degree in math, but I will probably, eventually, after debts are paid off, go into an RN-MSN program. I don't like doing that, but I think eventually, I will have to to remain competitive.

We'll see.

[cougarnurse]

Was talking to a former LPN teacher of mine, and she'd said we go through 'cycles' of needing nurses and all. I seem to remember her mentioning other times of over-gluts and crises, but can't remember exact time periods.