[lorianncw]

How much less do the teachers make than those that work on the floor. Why doesn't the government just increase their pay?.....the US already spends so much. Why don't they just deduct the cost from some other area? Are these foreign nurses being paid less than American ones?

[cougarnurse]

Originally Posted by lorianncw

How much less do the teachers make than those that work on the floor. Why doesn't the government just increase their pay?.....the US already spends so much. Why don't they just deduct the cost from some other area? Are these foreign nurses being paid less than American ones?

Schools are mainly run on taxes and tuition. Those who go to private schools tend to pay more tuition-wise(oh, do I know!)

To be honest, cutting costs from other areas isn't a good idea; the local grade school did that years ago, and they still haven't 'recovered' from it.

'Cat'

[xanahng]

Hello All


Foregin RNs are not paid less If they are not sponsored by your Hospital.
They are being encouraged to enter USA for "better" life.The truth is ; they have misreable live here from the time of entry. We wander why they don't go back? Well , its not so simple , first they have to pay a lot of money to get Passport back If Agency is involved, those who have family at least don't worry about Passport and food. I am absolutely sure that Non of those RNs would come in here If they knew what kind of live is coming their way and what they are expected to do for the "Wonderfull life in USA".

I know Philipino, Hindu, Korean , Mexican and European RNs they are not that diffrent from you , the only diffrence is accent and strong bound with family.
I expect from all of you a lot of " NO NO NO " is not true,
My opinion is based on many years of working with them and for them.
It takes a long time to get know them ,their Culture,and Values.
You blame Foregin Rns for everything ; Accent. Culture, sticking together taking your job
!!! Why don't you try to teach them what are your Values, Culture, and American way of working together...
Instead of blaming foregin RNs for taking your job stop and think why you don't want this job and what we can do to change it.
Long time ago One of the " FOREGIN RN " said ... why don't you write a book about present sytuaction in Nursing... and us Foregine RNs
in USA,, Why ??? I asked ?? because it doesn,t matter what you think or know You are here to do what " Citizens" don,t want to do....
If don't like it you are free to go back....... in mean time learn as much as you can ,stay together and keep smiling even If you don't feel like..

Have you ever heard Doctors talking about Foregin Doctors ???? I haven't !!!

Xana

[Cammer]

My experience with the recent influx of RNs from India has been that they are very hard working, complain little, knowledge of nursing skills is fair once they become accustomed to our equipment and methods, and are eager to learn. The only drawback that I have seen - and it's a HUGE one - is the communication skills. The lack of communication can be dangerous in a hospital setting.

As far as foreign nurses "taking our jobs," well, there is plenty of work to go around. We are still having problems filling the schedule.

They pay they are receiving is comparable to what other staff RNs are being paid so that rumor needs to be put to rest.

[lorianncw]

I just read an article that confirms that many foreign nurses do in fact receive reduced salaries. If so, the recruiters, hospital administrators, and government would have a huge incentive to hire a lower cost foreign nurse over an American nurse. Greed causes them to care most about the bottom line....not patient care.

This trend is in line with how our government and big business owners have been handling so many other industries....replace American workers with illegal or foreign workers at half the cost and double your profits. If you review the thread "Could This Lead to Socialized Medicine", I think you'd agree that these trends are only going to get worse.... The whole point of Bush's SPP and the "North American Union" is to merge the US with Mexico and Canada. Why?...so that we can "expand" our migrant worker programs and reduce costs even more for big business in the US and those that manufacture their products in China. For example, almost all imports from China go through the Long Beach , CA port. The American union workers their make $40 to $50 per hours. Then the goods are transported by US truck drivers. Many of these Americans will soon have their jobs replaced by Mexicans. With the passage of the SPP, imports will instead enter a Mexican port (owned by China) and manned by Mexicans for only about $2/hr. Then the goods will be transported by Mexican truck drivers into the US. Not only does this deal jepordize American jobs, but also Americans safety on the highways, and national security.

First immigrants worked in the farm fields, now it has expanded to the meat industry, sanitation, restaurants, painting, construction, gardening,....just to name a few. To claim that they are doing the jobs that "Americans don't want" is a lie! Ten years ago, Americans were doing these jobs and still would for minimum wage....but they are not willing to do them $2/hour like the migrant workers. This was recently proven with the Swift raids, which were busted for hiring over 1000 illegal immigrants in the meat packing industry. The next day, there were more than enough Americans lined up applying for those jobs.

I don't think the health care industry is immune to this kind of bottom line nonsense.

Also, to claim that foreign nurses are doing the jobs Americans don't want is NOT accurate when there are over 150,000 American applicants/yr being turned down from nursing school. At some schools the waiting line is over 3 years long!!!! Frankly, given the language barrier, I'd suspect that the majority of these American applicants would make much better candidates and provide better patient care than the foreign nurses.

Hospital administrators have already demonstrated major efforts to reduce costs in health care. Pediatric NPs replacing Pediatricians, CRNAs replacing Anesthesiologists, Optometrists replacing Ophthalmologists, foreign radiologists in India replacing American radiologists via teleradiology, etc....these are all cost cutting measures....

I am in support having foreign nurses IF they are NOT taking American jobs (meaning we've accepted all our applicants) and IF they are paid the same wage as American nurses. Payment of anything less than the going rate for Americans will lead the health care industry down a dangerous detour for patient care and the nursing industry.

Admittedly, I am very pro-American, but I think this is reaching a point where we need to start howling about foreigners replacing Americans in many industries...especially in health care given its risk to patient care.

Hope I didn't offend anyone with this post...

[Cammer]

You have very strong feelings on this subject, but everthing seems to be based on this one statement:

Originally Posted by lorianncw

I just read an article that confirms that many foreign nurses do in fact receive reduced salaries.

That article would be interesting for me to read. The nurses that have been hired at the HCA hospital where I work are making a similar wage when compared to what a similarly experienced RN would make in a similar setting. The information that I have is what these foreign nurses have actually told me. They are very open about it.

Do you have a link to your article?

Originally Posted by lorianncw

I am in support having foreign nurses IF they are NOT taking American jobs (meaning we've accepted all our applicants) and IF they are paid the same wage as American nurses. Payment of anything less than the going rate for Americans will lead the health care industry down a dangerous detour for patient care and the nursing industry.

I think it's pretty well established that there are many more nursing jobs than there are nurses. I have never met a nurse with a clean resume who wanted to work and was unable to find an employer. I think it's a safe bet that all qualified applicants are accepted in the current job market. Job security is very good in nursing.

I do agree with you that if newly immigrated nurses are paid significantly less than similarly qualified US nurses we will have a serious problem, but I haven't read your article yet and my personal experience shows that this is not the case.

Originally Posted by lorianncw

Admittedly, I am very pro-American, but I think this is reaching a point where we need to start howling about foreigners replacing Americans in many industries...especially in health care given its risk to patient care.

I think that you will have to show where foreign nurses are a risk to patient care for me to completely agree with you on this point. A large percentage of the staff at the hospital where I work were not born in the USA. We have nurses from Philipines, India, UK, New Zealand, Caribbean, Croatia, etc. I don't believe that patient outcomes are any different where I work than in other hospitals.

[lorianncw]

This was the article that suggests some foreign nurses are paid less:
http://www.vdare.com/guzzardi/nurses.htm

Nurse’s language barrier halts operation:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/2143680.stm

Nurse’s language barrier
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/health/1845272.stm
http://carpundit.typepad.com/carpund...nger_son_.html
http://www.businessgrouphealth.org/p...issuebrief.pdf
http://www.vdare.com/letters/tl_011607.htm

Patient language barrier
http://www.mcw.edu/display/router.asp?docid=17695
http://pediatrics.aappublications.or...full/116/3/575


One other point I failed to make before is that even if some foreign nurses are paid the same salary as American nurses, they are still hurting American nurses by supressing their wages.