[jillofalltrades]

Interesting. You have never worked as an employee in a union hospital and never belonged to a union. So how can you say that you know if they are good or bad. I have done both. I've walked a picket line (twice) and I've been a major part of organizing another hospital. The same hospital I worked at for 14 years without a union. The differences are amazing. They can no longer just let me go when they want. I had 20 years experience with the same hospital system and I hadn't gotten a raise 2-3 years as I had "hit the top of the pay scale". So I only got one if they changed the pay scale..and then I would have to wait until my next anniversary date. So if I was evaluated on the 1st of January...and they didn't change the payscale until 2 weeks later..I would have to wait for another year to get it.
Besides...Money may be what the hospitals say it is all about..sure it's a tangible thing to see and touch.. but that is NOT what makes nurse unionize. It is the lack of respect for what we do and how we do our jobs that motivates nurse to unionize. In a city where the other two system hospitals had been unionized for years we voted a union down 3-4 times. Until they started treating us different then they treated them. We were doing the same job in the same city...and valued less...meaning nursing input on equipment decisions..nursing input on scheduling, staffing ratios, inservices for new equipment, educational days..paid educational offerings..the same health benefits as our sister hospitals. Sure, I could have voted with my feet. but after 14 years I did not want to leave and I wanted to make sure that this hospital stayed the place I had loved to work at for years. I saw new nurses being hired at more then veterans of 12-13 years were making. All because of the "merit pay" system we had. Nurses who had 35 years experience sometimes made less then nurses who had been a nurse for 10. It all depended on your manager and how hell bent she was on saving the almighty dollar. ALot more good things then money came out of this...but money also was something important to us. We deserve to get paid a wage that compensates us for our experience and knowledge. Now not all nurses agreed. Some left...Most stayed. But the vote for a union was 3-1 for it. And it only took about 3 months to get that vote passed. Took two years to get a contract...which is an interesting process in itself.
I now work for another system that is non-union. As long as they treat me with the respect I am due I will be happy. If not..well, we will see.
My opinion only

[Faizi]

I can certainly see a need for nursing unions. However, I have never seen a successful nursing union.

Part of the reason for this is the divisions of nursing -- LPN, RN with diploma, RN with associates, RN with bachelors, CNAs.

I don't think you can have an effective union without a united front.

How does nursing achieve a united front?

Faizi

[Faizi]

Well, I said that.

I don't WANT unions in nursing. I want nurses to be treated as professionals. Supposedly, nurses with BSNs would be treated as professionals. I don't think professionals should have to punch a time clock. Most nurses with any degree still must punch time clocks.

I don't think nurses of any kind should be treated as subordinates. Nurses are advocates. The purpose of the nurse is to protect and promote the welfare of her/his patient while simultaneously promoting and advocating the medical stance of the physician to the patient and her/his family; carrying out orders with discretion.

As a nurse, I ask for a living wage, not riches accorded to physicians. I ask for dignity.

I loathe the idea of unions in nursing but I do know that a united front could be persuasive.

How can nurses of all kinds and all licensure achieve unity?

Faizi

[victrn43]

Okay, well then here is the thing.....
Maybe you should vote with your head. Do you think saying no and leaving at the end of your shift or leaving your facility for another place of employment is really going to "show them?" Who are the movers and shakers in this "new" generation of nursing. Let's see you have the babyboomers who gave their seats up when the doctors came to the nursing divisions, the nurses who are there just to do the work, not to rock the boat, and those who are frustrated with the state of nursing and are grandstanding in nursing forums such as this. Lobby, vote, participate, write your senators and network. At least nurses who join unions [for the most part] are joining because they want to do something, and they want to see change. Nursing is notoriously known and laughed at for eating their own, let's blame it on the staffing nurses, let's blame it on the administrators, let's blame it on the nurse managers....
Lets face it, we all contribute to the state of our profession, if it isn't the way we want it, we should do something about it and stop whining. Be pro-active, its the future of nursing,,,.

[Shelly Levitt]

Here is my opinion Unions do charge Union dues and it is a profitable organization in that respect. Some of the issues that affect nurses such as Discrimination, pay, etc. are covered by state and federal laws and can be enforced through government agencies and attorneys. I feel it is the most effective bargaining tool available to nurses in respect to the day to day issues that they must deal with. I had an issue years ago with an employer and I felt so supported when the Union supplied me with an attorney. I am PRO Union myself.

[lam]

Boy, reading this brings back memories. I worked in a nursing home where the administrater was out to get me because of demanding supplies for the patients, my mouth has gotten me into quite a few jams, but any way this administrater decided he was getting rid of me gave me a 3 day suspension for being 3 minutes late. I marched into his office and threw the paper on the desk said something and left. I didn't know he was talking to a state inspector at the time. any way I called the union rep. and he kept my job for me. when I went back after the 3 days he called me into his office and said " My sources told me you weren't coming back" My reply " I guess your sources were wrong" This was also the same place where a nurse wrote a Kwell order to be applied BID x 7 days and another nurse got mad at me for calling the doctor to treat stage IV dcubes on a pt. and you are right they will fire you if you put up a stink or make life so miserable that you are forced to leave. I was a fairly new LPN at that time. If there wasn't a union there I would have been fired on the spot.

[nursinghumor]

I'm the first to say that unions are not perfect. The are a helluva lot better than trying to fight the establishment on your own.

As an individual nurse, it's very difficult to make your case or advocate effectively for change.

Andrew Lopez, RN
http://www.nursinga2z.com

[lam]

That is putting it mildly. But, things are some what better than those days. I still feel like I have to battle all the time for pt. rights when I work in long term care. Then I get some nurses doing things just to aggravate me or to see if I am going to report them. I spend more time defending myself and the pts. and this is such a waste of time. One time I went to check on a pt that slipped out of her wheel chair, she was not hurt, alert, moving all extremities, no blood, no c/o pain, so I asked an aide to help me to put her back in the wheel chair. The LPN came and started yelling "you didn't check her" and then ran off to report me. Do they not teach nurses that the assessment starts with observation? Why would you leave an elderly person on the cold, hard floor for no reason? am I missing something here?

[nursinghumor]

Nurses by nature love to pick apart and put down other nurses. Nature of the beast.

I'd check the policy and procedure manual if your facility has one.

To be fair to the LPN, if the patient had been injured (a confused patient may not be able to voice c/o pain) you can do a lot more damage getting them up.

A physical assessment of the extremities and trunk as well as basic neuros is the standard of care in most states.

Andrew Lopez, RN
http://www.nursinga2z.com

[lam]

[ QUOTE ]
nursinghumor said:
Nurses by nature love to pick apart and put down other nurses. Nature of the beast.

I'd check the policy and procedure manual if your facility has one.

To be fair to the LPN, if the patient had been injured (a confused patient may not be able to voice c/o pain) you can do a lot more damage getting them up.

A physical assessment of the extremities and trunk as well as basic neuros is the standard of care in most states.

Andrew Lopez, RN
http://www.nursinga2z.com

[/ QUOTE ]
I think you missed my point, I said leaving them on the floor for no reason once you have determined that they were not hurt that is, I have worked in LTC for many years and have never missed an obviouse injury, in fact I have discovered fx hips when even the x-ray showed an old healing fx and doc ordered therapy ( no one listened until the fx became displaced)or I went to work to find a pt.had fallen at 10am and at 3pm had an elevated temp and knee pain and no x-ray done yet. Ya never hear any one say anything about those times or does any one ever go running to the DON with the good things ya do like saving a kids life or recognizing that a pt really isn't faking the seisures that were occuring every few minutes since 10 am and it is now 3:30 pm. oh well like you said nurses like to find fault. are you one of those nurses I know I'm not.