A question for the experienced

[Dat Mann]

hi folks!

I've got a question for the experienced nurses out there.

I have worked in human hospitals for about 8 months and now work in an animal specialty hospital as an assistant (6 month experience). I am now doing my pre-requisities for a BA-BSN degree. So, while I have some general idea of what working in a hospital is like, I don't know what it's like to be a nurse per se.

I am mostly familiar with the positive aspects of nursing -- good pay, rewarding work, a sense being helpful, caring, etc.

I am hoping that you folks can give me some of the disadvantages of being a nurse. Think of the following question: WhAT DO I NOT LIKE ABOUT MY JOB? This question relates to both being a MALE nurse and a NURSE in general.

I have heard that most of the new graduates who start working quit within a year -- I'm wondering why this is so. I have also heard that doctors are very disrespectful towards nurses -- how true is this?

I hope you don't see this question as a concentration towards the negative aspects of the profession but rather as a positive reality check.

Thanks a million, looking forward to your answers!!

[Cammer]

Originally Posted by Dat Mann

I have worked in human hospitals for about 8 months and now work in an animal specialty hospital as an assistant (6 month experience). I am now doing my pre-requisities for a BA-BSN degree. So, while I have some general idea of what working in a hospital is like, I don't know what it's like to be a nurse per se.

I am mostly familiar with the positive aspects of nursing -- good pay, rewarding work, a sense being helpful, caring, etc.

All those things are very true from most folks perspective. The pay can be very good, but the rewards and sense of caring and helpfulness can only be derived from your own perspective. It sounds like you have a good, positive perspective.

I am hoping that you folks can give me some of the disadvantages of being a nurse. Think of the following question: WhAT DO I NOT LIKE ABOUT MY JOB? This question relates to both being a MALE nurse and a NURSE in general.

For me nursing is what I am all about. It's not just a job for me. But more to the point of your question, I don't like having to accomodate the administration's idea of how serious my patients health status is. I don't like having to bust my butt taking care of 3-4 critical patients in an Intensive care unit while wearing the hat of secretary, charge nurse, case manager, pharmacist, CNA, housekeeping, and security guard all at once because the people who live in offices and drive Mercedes to work everyday can't come up with enough money to hire adequate staffing for the hospital, but they always manage a nice Christmas bonus for themselves.

Yes, I have had to work shifts without a charge nurse, secretary, or tech, because they cannot come up with adequate staffing. It can get pretty rough in the ICU when you have 21 patients, 12 on vents, no tech or secretary, and only 6 nurses - including the charge nurse. The patients really can't get adequate care and the staff can just forget about eating or bathroom breaks for 12 hours.

Related to being male, I don't like the assumption that I will always be available to leave the care of my own patients in order to do all the heavy lifting, or leaving the unit to respond to all the Code Gray calls (security incidents), or being called a Male Nurse as if it was somehow a different profession. I don't like being made unwelcome on the L&D floor, despite a multitude of male physicians wandering around. I'll never be a nurse mid-wife, but somehow I feel that isn't really an option for me anyway. I don't like the pervasive gender bias in nursing that remains despite many years of progressive civil rights awareness. It is getting better every year though.

I have heard that most of the new graduates who start working quit within a year -- I'm wondering why this is so.

I don't believe that most new grads quit within a year. I'd like to see the documentation on that statistic. As far as I know all the people I graduated with are still working in nursing, except for one guy who injured his shoulder while lifting someone else's patient. He left the profession on disability.

I have also heard that doctors are very disrespectful towards nurses -- how true is this?

Some doctors are disrespectul towards nurses. Some plumbers are disrespectful towards nurses also. I believe that if the disrespectful doctors became plumbers they would still be disrespectful. In other words, you cannot expect a respectful attitude from everyone you meet in life. I don't expect anything, therefore I am never disappointed.

I have learned that if you treat physicians with the respect that you would like then they will usually reciprocate. If they remain disrespectful then it's not my problem. I don't take it personally. I just feel bad for the people they live with. Then I laugh about it. A LOT.

I hope you don't see this question as a concentration towards the negative aspects of the profession but rather as a positive reality check.

I love nursing. I wish I had done it many years before I did. There are so many positive things about it that I forget about all the negativity that people invent. It's the best thing that I have ever done. The questions you asked are fair, but please don't forget that there isn't a perfect profession out there. As long as you have people involved there will be both bad and good, and nursing is a people oriented profession.

If you remain positive and refuse to listen to the rotten apples then you will love nursing. There are good days and bad days, but in the end I find it very worthwhile. Don't ever stop learning, join a nursing organization and get involved. It's very worthwhile.

[Dat Mann]

thanks, Cammer, for your reply! Those days of wearing many many hats sounds like a big problem!! Is this common in most hospitals or is it particular to yours and just a few?? In the end, it's the patient who is compromised and the nurse who is frustrated. Hope that doesn't happen too often...

Does anyone know what the hourly rate for a fresh-out-of-school BSN with a bit of experience in Los Angeles, Ca? The answers I get range from 50-60K Can anyone solidify this?

thanks!

:frustrated:

[orionseal]

Originally Posted by Dat Mann

thanks, Cammer, for your reply! Those days of wearing many many hats sounds like a big problem!! Is this common in most hospitals or is it particular to yours and just a few?? In the end, it's the patient who is compromised and the nurse who is frustrated. Hope that doesn't happen too often...

Does anyone know what the hourly rate for a fresh-out-of-school BSN with a bit of experience in Los Angeles, Ca? The answers I get range from 50-60K Can anyone solidify this?

thanks!

:frustrated:

For a true answer to that question you have to ask the proper person IE:the human resorces director / person hwo does the hiring at the institution you wish to work at. the wage you recieve is related to job location / cost of living in your area as well as many other factors. If its all about the money shop around. if it's about giving the best care you can to a patient then the pay scale dosnt matter.
I happen to be a nurse who is trying to get a job after having broken my neck in a farming accident shortly after graduating from nursing school and have had some little suckses ((even with a clean bill of health from my neurosurgeon) he put my lifting restrictions at 200 pounds) I personaly would be happy with any job as long as it payed the bills and allowed me to do what I have most wanted to do sence discovering that nursing was my calling.:luck:

[ROE_Wedge]

excellent post cammer! I love the attitude you bring to your profession. I hope i can be the same way when i finally get done with nursing school . Thanks!

[virgil rn]

this is an answer for dat Mann frm virgil rn.

I can tell you this,nursing is a great carrer if you are in NOT for the money.
Yes,we all need a paycheck,but less say you make 50 thousand a year,that is good pay,but if you have no compasion,or even no empathy for patients,no amount of money is going to help you take unhappiness from patients or families even when you are trying your best.or when you have a physician on the phone that does not understand your concerns. and is you that has to go and tell that patient that the doctor will see you in the morning but that there are no new orders.On THE other hand you have the good things: thankfull families,good relationships with physicians,supervisors that understand or at least are willing to listen,and the best of all if you make a living off something you like and that is to help others.

best wishes.

virgil RN

[intensive1]

VERY WELL SPOKEN/WRITTEN Cammer.
I could not agree with you more on ALL apects of your response.

Originally Posted by Cammer

All those things are very true from most folks perspective. The pay can be very good, but the rewards and sense of caring and helpfulness can only be derived from your own perspective. It sounds like you have a good, positive perspective.



For me nursing is what I am all about. It's not just a job for me. But more to the point of your question, I don't like having to accomodate the administration's idea of how serious my patients health status is. I don't like having to bust my butt taking care of 3-4 critical patients in an Intensive care unit while wearing the hat of secretary, charge nurse, case manager, pharmacist, CNA, housekeeping, and security guard all at once because the people who live in offices and drive Mercedes to work everyday can't come up with enough money to hire adequate staffing for the hospital, but they always manage a nice Christmas bonus for themselves.

Yes, I have had to work shifts without a charge nurse, secretary, or tech, because they cannot come up with adequate staffing. It can get pretty rough in the ICU when you have 21 patients, 12 on vents, no tech or secretary, and only 6 nurses - including the charge nurse. The patients really can't get adequate care and the staff can just forget about eating or bathroom breaks for 12 hours.

Related to being male, I don't like the assumption that I will always be available to leave the care of my own patients in order to do all the heavy lifting, or leaving the unit to respond to all the Code Gray calls (security incidents), or being called a Male Nurse as if it was somehow a different profession. I don't like being made unwelcome on the L&D floor, despite a multitude of male physicians wandering around. I'll never be a nurse mid-wife, but somehow I feel that isn't really an option for me anyway. I don't like the pervasive gender bias in nursing that remains despite many years of progressive civil rights awareness. It is getting better every year though.



I don't believe that most new grads quit within a year. I'd like to see the documentation on that statistic. As far as I know all the people I graduated with are still working in nursing, except for one guy who injured his shoulder while lifting someone else's patient. He left the profession on disability.



Some doctors are disrespectul towards nurses. Some plumbers are disrespectful towards nurses also. I believe that if the disrespectful doctors became plumbers they would still be disrespectful. In other words, you cannot expect a respectful attitude from everyone you meet in life. I don't expect anything, therefore I am never disappointed.

I have learned that if you treat physicians with the respect that you would like then they will usually reciprocate. If they remain disrespectful then it's not my problem. I don't take it personally. I just feel bad for the people they live with. Then I laugh about it. A LOT.



I love nursing. I wish I had done it many years before I did. There are so many positive things about it that I forget about all the negativity that people invent. It's the best thing that I have ever done. The questions you asked are fair, but please don't forget that there isn't a perfect profession out there. As long as you have people involved there will be both bad and good, and nursing is a people oriented profession.

If you remain positive and refuse to listen to the rotten apples then you will love nursing. There are good days and bad days, but in the end I find it very worthwhile. Don't ever stop learning, join a nursing organization and get involved. It's very worthwhile.

[TomB]

Excellent post Cammer.

I have learned how to deal with disrespectful/rude/***hole doctors. GIVE IT RIGHT BACK TO THEM!! If you back down and cower in the corner they've got you right where they want you and will continue to treat you like crap. Stand up to them and don't allow yourself to be treated disrespectfully. They will back down. This works for both male and female nurses.

I work in the ER and one time a doc (some EENT surgeon that was on-call) got angry and threw a sharp across the room. I explained to him that we don't tolerate that here in ER/Trauma and to go pick it up and remove all the sharps from his tray and dispose of them in sharps containers. I explained that it's out policy. He didn't and stormed off. I wrote him up and he ended up getting suspended (losing is priviledges) from that hospital for a week.

I work in a big city ER/trauma center (when I'm not in Florida) so you can get away with more stuff like that.

There's nothing that makes me more angry than to hear a nurse apologizing on the phone for doing their job and following a call order. "I'm sorry to bother you doctor, but pt. x has a fever of 103."

[Cammer]

Originally Posted by TomB

Excellent post Cammer.

I work in the ER and one time a doc (some EENT surgeon that was on-call) got angry and threw a sharp across the room. I explained to him that we don't tolerate that here in ER/Trauma and to go pick it up and remove all the sharps from his tray and dispose of them in sharps containers. I explained that it's out policy. He didn't and stormed off. I wrote him up and he ended up getting suspended (losing is priviledges) from that hospital for a week.

Great story! A few years back a surgeon threw a bloody scalpel at a nurse. Although the scalpel struck the nurse it didn't penetrate her scrubs. It's very sad, but, I don't believe anything came of the incident. The first question that came to my mind was "Why didn't the nurse press criminal charges against the surgeon?" An action such as that is assault with a deadly weapon. How can a surgeon get away with throwing a knife at someone? I do know that the surgeon is no longer at this hospital, but I'm not sure the reason, possibly another similar incident.

Whatever the incident, it's best to stay cool and professional so that the outcome will be in your favor.

[RPFeinman319]

Excellent posts all (and bonus points to you, Cammer!).

I have a slightly different take on rude physicians: A lot of members of our profession don't exactly think prior to speaking. Now, before you get your back hairs up and growl at me, ponder this question: How many times have you seen a co-worker do something that you KNOW to be unsafe, or incorrect? Mistakes are made by everyone; that's really not the point. But most of the physicians I know seem to have 2 distinct 'personalities': One for dealing with less-than-knowledgeble staff, and one for dealing with the rest.

I only mention this because I was speaking with a surgeon who was rounding in ICU last week, we had a low-key conversation regarding planned outcome post vent-weaning trials, and after he left, I was accosted by one of the nurses in the unit, who was, frankly, almost in tears. She asked WHY he was always so nice to me, and never spoke down to me when I come to the unit: "He's always so short-tempered with me. I think it's just a guy thing - you men always stick together." As she flounced off, I tried hard to put from my mind the fact that ALL IVs in our hospital must now be labeled with a blue sticker, proclaiming "IV ACCESS ONLY" because this particular nurse had a little "oops" one night. I wanted to be a smarty pants, and confess, "Yes, the penis club handshake seals the deal, and we're all cool with one another...wouldn't happen to have anything to do with the fact that you're an idiot, would it?" But, alas, my sensitivity training kicked in and I went back to weaning my patient from the ventilator.

Just a thought. The way I see it: Know your stuff, speak up when you don't, and remember you're just as human as they are. Speak from there, and they usually will too.

Will:luck: